JimGeier
12-08-2002, 02:28 PM
Has anyone heard of or been involved with deploying a public or private wireless LAN at a marina? I'm curious to know what propagation issues you might have encountered over water.
Click to See Complete Forum and Search --> : Marina applications
oshea85
12-08-2002, 08:34 PM
We're working up a business model for hitting some marinas now. I'd also be interested.
I don't think marinas are looking to provide coverage out on the water so much as covering boats when they're docked.
I don't think marinas are looking to provide coverage out on the water so much as covering boats when they're docked.
JimGeier
12-10-2002, 02:10 PM
That's what I was thinking too. I do some boating on Lake Erie and can see a real benefit to have WLAN connectivity while parked at the dock.
nemesis26
12-13-2002, 11:16 AM
Coverage over water is a double-edged sword. The wide-open expanse of water will give you very limited obsticles, to the extent that a standard 12dBi directional antenna is capable of transmitting up to 5 miles (at an average of 17dBm, without power amplification).
The flip side is that the farther the signal is transmitted, its azimuth begins hitting water.... and we all know what water does to RF. The humidity that eminates from large bodies of water during the summer also presents a challenge for transmission.
Given the lack of RF multipath - and H2O absorbing the transmission - it's not a very consitent environemt when deployed as a shoreline wireless service. Marinas would be feasible, although one would question if the backhaul expense (given that this hypothetical service is broadband) would merit a profitable business model, considering the number of likely subscribers.
I did a poll on this matter with boaters about 18 months ago and the response would surprise you. The cast majority (85%!) expressed no interest in such communication while boating, saying that their boat is an "escape" from their civilized lives, and that they "turn off" the world by choice.
Something to consider....
The flip side is that the farther the signal is transmitted, its azimuth begins hitting water.... and we all know what water does to RF. The humidity that eminates from large bodies of water during the summer also presents a challenge for transmission.
Given the lack of RF multipath - and H2O absorbing the transmission - it's not a very consitent environemt when deployed as a shoreline wireless service. Marinas would be feasible, although one would question if the backhaul expense (given that this hypothetical service is broadband) would merit a profitable business model, considering the number of likely subscribers.
I did a poll on this matter with boaters about 18 months ago and the response would surprise you. The cast majority (85%!) expressed no interest in such communication while boating, saying that their boat is an "escape" from their civilized lives, and that they "turn off" the world by choice.
Something to consider....
JimGeier
12-18-2002, 07:52 PM
Good points.
Most people use boats for leisure, not work. I do know someone, however, who installed a wireless LAN at his marina just to have access to the Internet while parked at the marina. He found that he could get much more work done there than anywhere else.
There are also a growing number of people who want to stay in touch with friends and family while away on vacation. I hate to take my laptop away on vacation (because I know I’ll do something related to work), but my wife and kids like to have it along to use email and instant messenger.
Most people use boats for leisure, not work. I do know someone, however, who installed a wireless LAN at his marina just to have access to the Internet while parked at the marina. He found that he could get much more work done there than anywhere else.
There are also a growing number of people who want to stay in touch with friends and family while away on vacation. I hate to take my laptop away on vacation (because I know I’ll do something related to work), but my wife and kids like to have it along to use email and instant messenger.
rodelcava
12-24-2002, 12:48 AM
The signal is really good in marinas. Normally boats are made with fiber glass, the same material as many antennas case.
Yes, it'll be a super service!! I have intalled AP in Cabo San Lucas at the marina and the customers are very happy with the service. We have a E1 connection without restriction, they really need a Internet connection to check their mails, banks, news in the correct language, weather, etc.
Normally customers in the marina are rich, so they don't have problem to pay a internet connection. If you have money to pay for a $200, 000 usd boat you can pay $10 usd a day to connect to internet!
I don't know how works marinas in USA, when the people is American too, I think the people pay for a internet connection when they are outside their states or country!
Yes, it'll be a super service!! I have intalled AP in Cabo San Lucas at the marina and the customers are very happy with the service. We have a E1 connection without restriction, they really need a Internet connection to check their mails, banks, news in the correct language, weather, etc.
Normally customers in the marina are rich, so they don't have problem to pay a internet connection. If you have money to pay for a $200, 000 usd boat you can pay $10 usd a day to connect to internet!
I don't know how works marinas in USA, when the people is American too, I think the people pay for a internet connection when they are outside their states or country!
nemesis26
12-24-2002, 09:15 AM
Originally posted by rodelcava
Normally boats are made with fiber glass, the same material as many antennas case.
Antenna housings are commonly fabricated out of industrial plastics and steel.
Originally posted by rodelcava
I have intalled AP in Cabo San Lucas at the marina and the customers are very happy with the service. We have a E1 connection without restriction...
If one already has an unrestricted T1/E1 , then it might as well be put to good use. However, not without the proper security precautions. Here in the states (especially San Francisco), an open broadband connection will lure hackers to take advantage of free broadband to download those 35 Kazaa DVD files. The remaining hackers will toast the enterprise network that the T1 in the marina resides on just for kicks.
Hence, one must implement proper security (i.e. VPN/IPSec), which requires the installation of specialty software. Add to this the inconvenience of configuring the VPN client, and the service suddenly becomes quite restrictive and less openly accessible.
Also.... the cost of broadband backhaul such as a T1 (if such connectivity is not already available) would be - at the very least - $700/month (not including the initial $1200+ cost of the circuit, setup fees, etc.). That would require 70 secure and registered users per month (at $10/day) to break even. Somewhat of a tall order for an average entrepreneur attempting to work an average-sized marina. Keep in mind, the transmission is only good for around 400 feet! After all, despite whatever additional antennas and power amps are added to the AP, users still communicate using 10dBm PCMCIA 802.11 cards.
The better solution is to just use a 56kbps modem router for backhaul, since checking email and browsing the web really doesn't require broadband.... and would be of no widespread interest to hackers.
Originally posted by rodelcava
Normally customers in the marina are rich, so they don't have problem to pay a internet connection. If you have money to pay for a $200, 000 usd boat you can pay $10 usd a day to connect to internet!
The wealthy individual you specify - in the states - would merely connect via his GPRS bluetooth-enabled cellular from anywhere and likely not care about the data bill. The novelty is to check your email *while* you're coasting around the bay.... not necessarily when docked at the marina.
Normally boats are made with fiber glass, the same material as many antennas case.
Antenna housings are commonly fabricated out of industrial plastics and steel.
Originally posted by rodelcava
I have intalled AP in Cabo San Lucas at the marina and the customers are very happy with the service. We have a E1 connection without restriction...
If one already has an unrestricted T1/E1 , then it might as well be put to good use. However, not without the proper security precautions. Here in the states (especially San Francisco), an open broadband connection will lure hackers to take advantage of free broadband to download those 35 Kazaa DVD files. The remaining hackers will toast the enterprise network that the T1 in the marina resides on just for kicks.
Hence, one must implement proper security (i.e. VPN/IPSec), which requires the installation of specialty software. Add to this the inconvenience of configuring the VPN client, and the service suddenly becomes quite restrictive and less openly accessible.
Also.... the cost of broadband backhaul such as a T1 (if such connectivity is not already available) would be - at the very least - $700/month (not including the initial $1200+ cost of the circuit, setup fees, etc.). That would require 70 secure and registered users per month (at $10/day) to break even. Somewhat of a tall order for an average entrepreneur attempting to work an average-sized marina. Keep in mind, the transmission is only good for around 400 feet! After all, despite whatever additional antennas and power amps are added to the AP, users still communicate using 10dBm PCMCIA 802.11 cards.
The better solution is to just use a 56kbps modem router for backhaul, since checking email and browsing the web really doesn't require broadband.... and would be of no widespread interest to hackers.
Originally posted by rodelcava
Normally customers in the marina are rich, so they don't have problem to pay a internet connection. If you have money to pay for a $200, 000 usd boat you can pay $10 usd a day to connect to internet!
The wealthy individual you specify - in the states - would merely connect via his GPRS bluetooth-enabled cellular from anywhere and likely not care about the data bill. The novelty is to check your email *while* you're coasting around the bay.... not necessarily when docked at the marina.
rodelcava
12-26-2002, 03:51 PM
Antenna housings are commonly fabricated out of industrial plastics and steel.
Originally posted by nemesis26
HyperGain® HG2415U
2.4 GHz High Performance 15 dBi Omnidirectional Antenna with 3 Degree Downtilt
Mechanical Specifications
Weight 1.16 kg
Length 1.52 m
Radome Material White Fiberglass
Connector Integral N Type Female
Mounting 2.5" diameter mast
Polarization Vertical
Wind Survival >150 MPH
http://www.hyperlinktech.com/web/hg2415u.php
Originally posted by nemesis26
Keep in mind, the transmission is only good for around 400 feet! After all, despite whatever additional antennas and power amps are added to the AP, users still communicate using 10dBm PCMCIA 802.11 cards.
We have links up to 1000 feet with Cisco 350 AP and a 15 DBI ominidirectional antenna and clients with linksys wusb11 @ 11mbps (.1% packet loss)
My best link is 2 miles with wusb11 @ 11 MBPS. and 80% signal strenght and 90% quality. We used a 1 watt amp. and 15 dbi omni antenna on a cisco 350 ap.
We tested with some pcmcia cards and they don't have good performance because the antenna is too small.
Originally posted by nemesis26
The better solution is to just use a 56kbps modem router for backhaul, since checking email and browsing the web really doesn't require broadband.... and would be of no widespread interest to hackers.
Broadband solutions are growing very fast, people in states commonly use DSL or cable modem. If you give a 56 kbps link they are going away to bore. I can't use a 56 kbps modem because is bore and most new web designers use 600 kb flash sites, with a 56 kbps is too slow.
Originally posted by nemesis26
The wealthy individual you specify - in the states - would merely connect via his GPRS bluetooth-enabled cellular from anywhere and likely not care about the data bill. The novelty is to check your email *while* you're coasting around the bay.... not necessarily when docked at the marina.
You say cellular phone? or LEO sat phone like Globalstar or GPRS inmarsat terminals? because they aren't cells carriers on the water.
Originally posted by nemesis26
HyperGain® HG2415U
2.4 GHz High Performance 15 dBi Omnidirectional Antenna with 3 Degree Downtilt
Mechanical Specifications
Weight 1.16 kg
Length 1.52 m
Radome Material White Fiberglass
Connector Integral N Type Female
Mounting 2.5" diameter mast
Polarization Vertical
Wind Survival >150 MPH
http://www.hyperlinktech.com/web/hg2415u.php
Originally posted by nemesis26
Keep in mind, the transmission is only good for around 400 feet! After all, despite whatever additional antennas and power amps are added to the AP, users still communicate using 10dBm PCMCIA 802.11 cards.
We have links up to 1000 feet with Cisco 350 AP and a 15 DBI ominidirectional antenna and clients with linksys wusb11 @ 11mbps (.1% packet loss)
My best link is 2 miles with wusb11 @ 11 MBPS. and 80% signal strenght and 90% quality. We used a 1 watt amp. and 15 dbi omni antenna on a cisco 350 ap.
We tested with some pcmcia cards and they don't have good performance because the antenna is too small.
Originally posted by nemesis26
The better solution is to just use a 56kbps modem router for backhaul, since checking email and browsing the web really doesn't require broadband.... and would be of no widespread interest to hackers.
Broadband solutions are growing very fast, people in states commonly use DSL or cable modem. If you give a 56 kbps link they are going away to bore. I can't use a 56 kbps modem because is bore and most new web designers use 600 kb flash sites, with a 56 kbps is too slow.
Originally posted by nemesis26
The wealthy individual you specify - in the states - would merely connect via his GPRS bluetooth-enabled cellular from anywhere and likely not care about the data bill. The novelty is to check your email *while* you're coasting around the bay.... not necessarily when docked at the marina.
You say cellular phone? or LEO sat phone like Globalstar or GPRS inmarsat terminals? because they aren't cells carriers on the water.
nemesis26
12-27-2002, 09:12 AM
Not sure what specs you're coming up with re: antenna design, but virtually all CPE-based antenna housings are fabricated out of industrial plastic or plastic composites. "Fiberglass Radome" is different than what one would consider the fiberglass of a boat. Regardless, material composition is irrelevent in this situation.
We have links up to 1000 feet with Cisco 350 AP and a 15 DBI ominidirectional antenna and clients with linksys wusb11 @ 11mbps (.1% packet loss)
My best link is 2 miles with wusb11 @ 11 MBPS. and 80% signal strenght and 90% quality. We used a 1 watt amp. and 15 dbi omni antenna on a cisco 350 ap.
Well, of course you are, since you're using a 1 Watt power amp (likely eminating over 30dBm of output power @ 23dB of transmit gain alone) coupled with a 15dBi directional antenna, with a +10dB 802.11 radio, which would collectively be illegal in the United States under part 15 of the FCC rules governing 2.4Ghz transmission. At 1 watt, you're way over the 37dBm of transmitted power allotted for point-to-multipoint transmission in this spectrum.
Reagrdless of being overpowered and shut down by the FCC in the States, how many of these "Linksys wusb11" devices do you intend to give away or rent out under a sustainable business model?
(BTW, have you GPS'd that "1000 feet" of the USB client? 500-600 feet can optimistically seem like a thousand unless you're methodically employing a GPS device.)
We tested with some pcmcia cards and they don't have good performance because the antenna is too small.
That was my point.
A 10dBm PCMCIA card or integrated 802.11 chipset should always be regarded as the default CPE in this case. You expect people to install (or install for them) a $140 directional antenna on a boat just to check email/IM for a day or a few hours? Even if the client antenna is rented out, its maintenance would likely be too inconvenient and logistically impractical.
(BTW, antenna size of a PCMCIA is not the issue, it's the allotment of transmittied power {coupled with RF modulation} that is governed by the FCC within that particular frequency. For example, the 2.5Ghz PCMCIA CPE of IP Wireless can transmit in excess of a mile, because 2.5Ghz MMDS is private spectrum, and consequently is allowed to transmit at higher power levels).
That aside, boaters represent a very finite market to target for service, given the geographical restriction of transmission. Remember, this must make sense as a viable business model, particularly since a broadband-based service must incorporate backhaul expense and the administration/configuration/expense of VPN/IPSec client software.
Broadband solutions are growing very fast, people in states commonly use DSL or cable modem. If you give a 56 kbps link they are going away to bore. I can't use a 56 kbps modem because is bore and most new web designers use 600 kb flash sites, with a 56 kbps is too slow.
We're talking about boaters who merely need to keep in touch with the vitals here... email, websites, IM, etc.
A 56kbps modem router on the back end is presently just fine for such activity, and would not overtly attract hackers.
You still haven't addressed the obvious hacker/compromise-of-service issues here that invariably result from the deployment of an unsecured, openly-accessible, outdoor broadband wireless service.
You say cellular phone? or LEO sat phone like Globalstar or GPRS inmarsat terminals? because they aren't cells carriers on the water.
Conventional GPRS/GSM/CDMA cell coverage from land-based towers typically extends 2km or more thoughout a metropolitan shorline, providng boaters with cellular data accessibility while cruising around the shores of tier-one cities such as Chicago, San Francisco, New York, Miami, San Diego, etc.
We have links up to 1000 feet with Cisco 350 AP and a 15 DBI ominidirectional antenna and clients with linksys wusb11 @ 11mbps (.1% packet loss)
My best link is 2 miles with wusb11 @ 11 MBPS. and 80% signal strenght and 90% quality. We used a 1 watt amp. and 15 dbi omni antenna on a cisco 350 ap.
Well, of course you are, since you're using a 1 Watt power amp (likely eminating over 30dBm of output power @ 23dB of transmit gain alone) coupled with a 15dBi directional antenna, with a +10dB 802.11 radio, which would collectively be illegal in the United States under part 15 of the FCC rules governing 2.4Ghz transmission. At 1 watt, you're way over the 37dBm of transmitted power allotted for point-to-multipoint transmission in this spectrum.
Reagrdless of being overpowered and shut down by the FCC in the States, how many of these "Linksys wusb11" devices do you intend to give away or rent out under a sustainable business model?
(BTW, have you GPS'd that "1000 feet" of the USB client? 500-600 feet can optimistically seem like a thousand unless you're methodically employing a GPS device.)
We tested with some pcmcia cards and they don't have good performance because the antenna is too small.
That was my point.
A 10dBm PCMCIA card or integrated 802.11 chipset should always be regarded as the default CPE in this case. You expect people to install (or install for them) a $140 directional antenna on a boat just to check email/IM for a day or a few hours? Even if the client antenna is rented out, its maintenance would likely be too inconvenient and logistically impractical.
(BTW, antenna size of a PCMCIA is not the issue, it's the allotment of transmittied power {coupled with RF modulation} that is governed by the FCC within that particular frequency. For example, the 2.5Ghz PCMCIA CPE of IP Wireless can transmit in excess of a mile, because 2.5Ghz MMDS is private spectrum, and consequently is allowed to transmit at higher power levels).
That aside, boaters represent a very finite market to target for service, given the geographical restriction of transmission. Remember, this must make sense as a viable business model, particularly since a broadband-based service must incorporate backhaul expense and the administration/configuration/expense of VPN/IPSec client software.
Broadband solutions are growing very fast, people in states commonly use DSL or cable modem. If you give a 56 kbps link they are going away to bore. I can't use a 56 kbps modem because is bore and most new web designers use 600 kb flash sites, with a 56 kbps is too slow.
We're talking about boaters who merely need to keep in touch with the vitals here... email, websites, IM, etc.
A 56kbps modem router on the back end is presently just fine for such activity, and would not overtly attract hackers.
You still haven't addressed the obvious hacker/compromise-of-service issues here that invariably result from the deployment of an unsecured, openly-accessible, outdoor broadband wireless service.
You say cellular phone? or LEO sat phone like Globalstar or GPRS inmarsat terminals? because they aren't cells carriers on the water.
Conventional GPRS/GSM/CDMA cell coverage from land-based towers typically extends 2km or more thoughout a metropolitan shorline, providng boaters with cellular data accessibility while cruising around the shores of tier-one cities such as Chicago, San Francisco, New York, Miami, San Diego, etc.
wirelessgeek
01-04-2003, 03:29 PM
I have installed some wireless applications around water and found out that if you are in a marina environment with an omni antenna and the boats are docked it works pretty well, because there typically isn't alot of exposed water.
However when you try to transmit out over the water the reflective properties of the water cause alot of multipath. I installed a point to point connection over a lake and throughput is not very reliable.
However when you try to transmit out over the water the reflective properties of the water cause alot of multipath. I installed a point to point connection over a lake and throughput is not very reliable.
agent007
01-13-2003, 11:10 AM
I've already seen a reference to IP Wireless in this thread, I'm wondering if anyone has any insight into the true efficiency of their product, or if anyone has been part of Vivato's switch/antenna testing. If the Vivato product can actually do what they claim, geez, it takes WiFi to the next level......
nemesis26
01-13-2003, 12:37 PM
If the Vivato product can actually do what they claim, geez, it takes WiFi to the next level......
I belive that topic warrants a new thread, since Vivato's technical claims do indeed represent a compelling concept.
Personally, I don't trust Vivato very much until they begin distribution and someone vigorously tests the proposed merits of their product. One can make anything seem like a magical product using 2.4 Ghz under controlled conditions. Hell, we were doing fixed point-to-multipoint 802.11 broadband with a NLOS indoor CPE using bi-directional AGC PAs from a 3-mile distance way back in Jan of 2000. Could it be shown as a "Gee Whiz" demonstration? Sure. Was it a practical solution for mass-market deployment? Hardly.
The phased-array antenna technology that Vivato claims to have integrated is interesting in theory... but we're still talking about spectrum where a cordless telephone (and a myriad of other conflicting 2.4Ghz devices and services) can easily muddle any transmission.
There's a reason why major carriers avoid any commercial deployment of 2.4Ghz like the plague, and it isn't because they feel some sort of absurd threat from Wi.-Fi. The biggest issues are interference, capacity, and security. Vivato claims compatibilty will all IEEE 802.11 client devices, so the same issues will seemingly still fester to exist, albeit with perhaps a bit better range.
I belive that topic warrants a new thread, since Vivato's technical claims do indeed represent a compelling concept.
Personally, I don't trust Vivato very much until they begin distribution and someone vigorously tests the proposed merits of their product. One can make anything seem like a magical product using 2.4 Ghz under controlled conditions. Hell, we were doing fixed point-to-multipoint 802.11 broadband with a NLOS indoor CPE using bi-directional AGC PAs from a 3-mile distance way back in Jan of 2000. Could it be shown as a "Gee Whiz" demonstration? Sure. Was it a practical solution for mass-market deployment? Hardly.
The phased-array antenna technology that Vivato claims to have integrated is interesting in theory... but we're still talking about spectrum where a cordless telephone (and a myriad of other conflicting 2.4Ghz devices and services) can easily muddle any transmission.
There's a reason why major carriers avoid any commercial deployment of 2.4Ghz like the plague, and it isn't because they feel some sort of absurd threat from Wi.-Fi. The biggest issues are interference, capacity, and security. Vivato claims compatibilty will all IEEE 802.11 client devices, so the same issues will seemingly still fester to exist, albeit with perhaps a bit better range.
Craig Sanderson
01-15-2003, 09:58 PM
Hello.
Please take a look at this news article, detailing a very successful WiFi installation at Raffles Marina in Singapore.
http://computerworld.com.sg/pcwsg.nsf/unidlookup/6B51F289C14C628048256BCE00171327?OpenDocument
There are links to both the systems integrator and Raffles marina in the above article.
Kind regards,
Craig Sanderson.
Please take a look at this news article, detailing a very successful WiFi installation at Raffles Marina in Singapore.
http://computerworld.com.sg/pcwsg.nsf/unidlookup/6B51F289C14C628048256BCE00171327?OpenDocument
There are links to both the systems integrator and Raffles marina in the above article.
Kind regards,
Craig Sanderson.
M00NCHILD
01-22-2003, 02:55 PM
hey guys........
in 5 years i'm retiring to my houseboat and plan to travel throughout the inland and coastal waterways..........
i'll be using every wireless device and technology i can to administrate my personal and financial affairs.........
this includes telephones, wifi, and satellite internet/tv.........
i aint alone............
make the service available with a low overhead and as time goes on the people will flock to the convenience then watch the margins grow.........
i only wish i had the expertise and the capital to start up a hotspot company at marinas instead of being a truck driver..........
best of luck to you............
MIKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE EE
in 5 years i'm retiring to my houseboat and plan to travel throughout the inland and coastal waterways..........
i'll be using every wireless device and technology i can to administrate my personal and financial affairs.........
this includes telephones, wifi, and satellite internet/tv.........
i aint alone............
make the service available with a low overhead and as time goes on the people will flock to the convenience then watch the margins grow.........
i only wish i had the expertise and the capital to start up a hotspot company at marinas instead of being a truck driver..........
best of luck to you............
MIKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE EE
JimGeier
01-22-2003, 05:49 PM
Interesting... I guess marina applications are becoming more popular for people such as you who will be spending some time on a boat.
Mitch@eHarbor.o
01-24-2003, 03:09 PM
Marinas are a great idea.
Coming up with a money making biz plan is the task.
eHarbor was the first company to target marinas. My partners were a VP of UUNET and a fantastic angel. WouldCom/MCI was to be our lead round. We started this a few years ago and even before the IEEE 802.11 standards were set. And should we go FHSS or DSSS? As the standards evolved and it was clear that DSSS would win the war, we had to go with it. Sort of a VHS vs BETA argument in which VHS (DSSS) won.
Then the problem was how to Authenticate customers that would roam from marina to marina? The APs then only contained a white/black list of MACids, at best. It would be a pain to update every AP, in every location with your customers MACid, so we used RADIUS from the start. Our routers cost more than the radios, but could make a RADIUS request to our RADIUS server(s) in Michigan and Maryland and Authenticate anyone, anywhere.
We installed sites in MI, MD, FL and CA just to demonstrate our ability to Authenticate users and serve up custom screens/ads depending on which site they logged in from.
The VC (remember VCs?) guys loved it. Potential boating customers loved it. Everyone loved it.
However, we had the same flawed financial model as the Dot.Coms. "Build it and they will come." didn't work for us either.
The infrastructure costs, the site costs, the connectivity costs were all too large to be supported by customer monthly fees. Plus, customers want service everywhere before they will sign up in the numbers needed to support that model.
This problem still exists for all hot-spot owners.
We now have a much different model. It is scalable, much less investment intensive and builds value over time.
Marinas? Sure.
Mitch@eHarbor.org
Coming up with a money making biz plan is the task.
eHarbor was the first company to target marinas. My partners were a VP of UUNET and a fantastic angel. WouldCom/MCI was to be our lead round. We started this a few years ago and even before the IEEE 802.11 standards were set. And should we go FHSS or DSSS? As the standards evolved and it was clear that DSSS would win the war, we had to go with it. Sort of a VHS vs BETA argument in which VHS (DSSS) won.
Then the problem was how to Authenticate customers that would roam from marina to marina? The APs then only contained a white/black list of MACids, at best. It would be a pain to update every AP, in every location with your customers MACid, so we used RADIUS from the start. Our routers cost more than the radios, but could make a RADIUS request to our RADIUS server(s) in Michigan and Maryland and Authenticate anyone, anywhere.
We installed sites in MI, MD, FL and CA just to demonstrate our ability to Authenticate users and serve up custom screens/ads depending on which site they logged in from.
The VC (remember VCs?) guys loved it. Potential boating customers loved it. Everyone loved it.
However, we had the same flawed financial model as the Dot.Coms. "Build it and they will come." didn't work for us either.
The infrastructure costs, the site costs, the connectivity costs were all too large to be supported by customer monthly fees. Plus, customers want service everywhere before they will sign up in the numbers needed to support that model.
This problem still exists for all hot-spot owners.
We now have a much different model. It is scalable, much less investment intensive and builds value over time.
Marinas? Sure.
Mitch@eHarbor.org
captainjr
03-02-2003, 03:31 PM
Hi Jim,
I am looking at a small harbor application for a city owned set of mooring buoys. Max distance is probably about 1.5 miles. Havent' chose the h/w yet, more concerned about boater's abililty to configure their laptops...
I am looking at a small harbor application for a city owned set of mooring buoys. Max distance is probably about 1.5 miles. Havent' chose the h/w yet, more concerned about boater's abililty to configure their laptops...
wi-fiplanet.com
Copyright WebMediaBrands Inc., All Rights Reserved.
Copyright WebMediaBrands Inc., All Rights Reserved.