Antennas

[Contravene]

I have an orinoco gold card in a 2wire case, I purchased an antenna for it about 3 weeks ago (it was really cheap 7dBi but it lasted me no time at all), It ended up breaking and now I'm asking for some help or ideas on what I should get to better the connection.

I work in a store and when it is slow sometimes I can jump on the wireless internet that the area provides, but the store I am in has horrible reception.

I would like to increase my signal strength I was thinking of possible getting a device that I could place somewhere that would amplify the signal, or just a better antenna to seek out the signal.

I'am willing to spend around $200 for these devices.

Ideas beyond what I have discribed are welcome, if anything needs to be known to further help me out please discribe how, and where I can provide this information.

Thankyou very much.

[M/Q]

If you do not need mobility and have an Ethernet connection, I might suggest getting bridge device or an AP that will act as a bridge and locate it where it will get good reception. Then run Ethernet cable back to the computer. That device also could have better antennas on it if required.

[Contravene]

Yes I do need mobility I will be using a laptop that does not have access to an ethernet connection only to wireless.

I do not know much about a bridge but the only things I can use are things that will utilize the wireless connection, nothing ethernet will be used in this.

[M/Q]

You then have a few different choices. First is using an AP as a repeater. That IMO is the least appealing in that you lose a great deal of bandwidth due to the repeating.

Next would be to enhance your existing adapter. Does it have the ability to add an external antenna? What is the brand and model of the adapter?

Third and what I consider the best approach would be to still use the bridge I mentioned in the previous post, but instead of connecting it to your computer, connect it to another AP. Set the channel on that AP to one as far away from the main device to prevent interference and that is all there is to it. You need two devices connected by a Ethernet cable, but what you have done is effectly created your own coverage area in the building. You still should be able to meet your financial requirements by using consumer grade equipment instead of business grade.

[Contravene]

I have no way of accessing this AP to attach anything to it, it is merely an AP in the area that the people who rent out the space for the companies allows. Its a free AP like say in a coffee shop, but because of where I work the geometry, the make up and what is in the shop there is a horrible signal.

The only thing I have to work with is my laptop and my network card which as stated in the first post is an Orinoco gold 802.11 B card in a 2wire case, it does have an external adaptor for an antenna for MC-card connectors, but a pigtail adaptor can fix whatever antenna I should get.

I'm thinking of buying a Senao 2511 CD PLUS EXT2 it has the ability to use 2 external antennas and uses a MMCX attachment, and possibly a yagi antenna but that is all speculation as to will it work or not, I would really like to be able to mount something further away that will transmit a better signal to my card.

Also I just realized this is the wrong area to be posting in.

[M/Q]

No you mis-understood. My suggestion would be to create a second wireless network the topology would be

HotSpot AP...RF...Bridge...Ethernet cable...Your AP...RF...Notebook

Then you could move around anywhere in the building and have a connection.

The options of adding an antenna are viable as well. You should be able to find a pigtail for your Proxim card and that is a good card.

Also the fact that the Senao has two antennas does not mean that it will have twice the ability to capture a signal.

[Contravene]

I realize it will not have twice the ability to capture the signal but that is how Senao makes them and their internal antenna is a long range antenna built in I do believe they are also stronger then the Orinoco gold cards as well.

Well for me to even get a decent signal for the bridge to pass along would mean I would have to move it something like 30 feet away then run 30 feet of ethernet cable in the store I work with.

My boss is down with me getting a better signal but he sure as hell is not down with running 30 feet of ethernet cable through the store.

Possible solution?

http://www.techdepot.com/product.asp?productID=2633369&info=Over#tabs


Thankyou

[M/Q]

You have to think about this better. If you expect a pc card with an antenna to get good enough reception why wouldn't a bridge with an external antenna get the same if not better reception as it an be located as close as possible to the source inside your store.

I can sense your un-willingness to accept logical opinions other than what you want to hear, and then argue with them. So, wish you luck.

[Contravene]

I'm not kicking the idea of a bridge out I just cannot connect a bridge say if I mount it 15 feet from the area where I place my laptop then run 20feet of ethernet cable to my laptop. All the connections to my laptop need to be obtained wirelessly (?) that is why I put that link down that is a bridge with a wi-fi booster that my laptop can connect to without the use of an ethernet cable, I can mount that bridge in the arcade towards the front, but since I'm not sure on how these work that is why I'm asking you.

[M/Q]

Did you read the other post?????

Hotspot AP...RF...Bridge...Cable ...AP...RF...Computer.

RF equals wireless signal

The bridge/cable/AP can all be in the same place and will act as a repeater. This approach is used all the time to prevent the repeater's drop in bandwidth and increased number of drops. You have a weak signal condition already, so I would not suggest just a single device repeater.

Enough said.

[Contravene]

No you mis-understood. My suggestion would be to create a second wireless network the topology would be

HotSpot AP...RF...Bridge...Ethernet cable...Your AP...RF...Notebook

Then you could move around anywhere in the building and have a connection.



Is what you said and I did not know RF stood for wireless signal the way i was reading it was hotspot AP to bridge then ethernet to AP to my notebook as you can see I was not understanding what you were expressing I wasnt trying to fight what you were saying, I just was misunderstanding it.

So then this would be exactly what I should us?

http://www.techdepot.com/product.asp?productID=2633369&info=Tech#tabs

[M/Q]

No, that is just a power booster for a single device. That could be used on the bridge device to get a better connection to the Hotspot AP, but it will not help the other part of the network I am talking about.

A bad way to enhance an RF signal is to use a single device approach. here is the sequence of events that takes place.
1. Incoming signal from Hotspot
2. Received by Repeater
3. Acknowledgment signal sent back to Hotspot AP
4. Transmit outgoing signal to computer
5. Receive acknowledgment signal from computer

This is the sending of one packet, and it uses a great deal more bandwidth to obtain the same results. So your bandwidth is cut to less than half it was initially. Also this type of network needs a very good RF signal strength. You do not have that even with the power booster.

My approach
1. Incoming signal form hotspot
2. Received by Bridge
3. Acknowledgment signal sent back to Hotspot AP
3. Passed to AP via Ethernet Cable to your AP
4. AP transmitts outgoing signal to computer
5. Recieve acknowledgement signal from computer

The difference is that the Bridge and AP can be sending and receiving at the same time whereas a single repeater cannot. Also the signal strength restrictions for a single device repeater do not apply. You get the maximum thoughput bandwidth available for the protocol being used.

[Contravene]

Ok that makes alot more sense, I understand the difference as the Repeater has to wait for a signal and to wait for a reply from the AP, your approach seems much more efficent.

So I will need to buy a bridge and an AP the bridge will be connected to the access point via ethernet. If I'm getting any of this wrong please correct me.

[M/Q]

The devices you will need can be two AP's one setup as a bridge and one setup as an AP. It would be best to get the smae brand and model for both to facilitate configuration. Now you still may need enhanced antenna on the bridge that is making the link with the Hotspot AP.

[Contravene]

Ok so i think im going to go with a Hawking HWBA11 all i have to find out now is if the antenna can be switched out for one with a higher dBi.

[Contravene]

they can but I'm getting conflicting ideas on what I should use now, I was over at netstumbler.org and the idea you put forward was seem as somewhat inefficent and that a wifi range extender set on repeater might be more efficent.

[M/Q]

Did they give any proof or reasoning. I would be more than willing to argue the facts. My method maybe many things but it is not less efficient. That is just illogical. You yourself realized that when I explained the packet travel. Here is a link to industry experts and their opinions.

http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2004/0830wizards.html

Pay attention to Mr. Haugdahl from WildPackets. He states my cases pretty good. As well as brings up the concerns about directional antenna use. A single device repeater will work, but at what degraded performance. It is just an easy answer for home consumers. You will never see a single device repeater on any kind of business level communications systems. Do not expect to play Internet games on a repeater either as it will frustrate you. You are running 802.11b lets say. that is at most under ideal conditions about 5mb throughput bandwidth. Then you half to cut that in half when you use a single device repeater. And that is being optimistic as there is an increased management bandwidth loss occurred when using that type of repeater. So you are down to maybe less than 2mb throughput. And you have a weak signal as well which will add to the mix.

But, it is up to you obviously

[Contravene]

I understand how yours works, and I am more willing to go with it, now i'm also getting conlficting reports saying that if I was even to set this up that it would be denied or mess up the network the mall provides.

This is from the people at netstumbler.org. They also seem to be a little more conservative and care more about people getting things legitametly then people being able to enjoy things.

[M/Q]

The device acting as a bridge is nothing more than a wireless client just like the using a wireless network card in your computer. The only thing a bridge does is allow itself to be hooked up to another device that will transfer the packets via another wireless path. If you have permission to access the Hotspot with a wireless notebook, then access it through the bridge/wireless workgroup client is the same thing.

[Contravene]

See that was what I was thinking but these guys are like noo the way the building is made is wrong there are metal studs and your enclosed and geometry is all around. Yes some might be true, but I have a clear path. Right now I'm going to put this project on hold but thankyou very much for your time and patience.

[M/Q]

They are way to negative. I like to experiment. I would say if you can get a signal with a notebook and a pc card anywhere remotely close to your location then a device with an enhanced directional antenna will be just fine. The normal vertical dipole antenna has a gain of about 2dBi. A simple directional patch antenna can have up to 8dBi gain that is an huge increase just from the fact that you can direct most ofthe RF at the source.

Best of luck, and if any more help is needed just please ask.

[Contravene]

Hahah hurray I love to experiment too life is way to complicated to just do shit by the book sometimes you gotta blow something up and loose set of eyebrows just to tell a story to your kids.

But what I have gained from this that I think will work well and be concealed is a directional dome or "smoke detector" antenna, I can mount it on a wall or even on the ceiling of my work and run the cable through the roof and drop it down in the back room, since I will be up higher I will have a better line of sight as well.

But thanks for everything and I will ask if I have anymore questions.