Combining two DSL lines for more bandwidth ?

[BobY777]

Lets say I have one DSL line at a hotel and usage is going up to where I need more bandwidth.

I need to add a second DSL line for higher capacity.

Exactly how do I add that second line to give me twice the capacity of just one line ?

Same question could be asked if I used a T1 line.

I only have one WAN port in my Internet gateway to take the one DSL line, but now I'd like to add a 2nd DSL line for more bandwidth. How do I do that ?

Thanks,

[ICT]

Hi Bob,
What you need is a device which can combine 2 ADSL and increase the bandwidth. I did a similar project with a Govt. education institute by combining 4 ADSL lines. This setup also provides you with auto fail-over. Hardware I used was 'Net Cyclone'. In your case, this model should help :

http://www.xrio.co.uk/product-c200.asp


Its going to cost you some $$$.

Let me know if this was help to you.

[BobY777]

Hello ICT:

Thank you for the response.

Did the 4 DSL lines give you 4 times the download speed? I'm wondering that maybe it won't.

Reason being is that maybe a download maybe can only address one IP address it comes in on? I assume each of the 4 ADSL lines each has its own IP address (either dynamic or static).

I'm wondering if the main things that are obtained with 2 or more ADSL lines (or 2 or more DSL lines, or 2 or more T1 lines) are mainly redundancy and not higher download speed?

Also maybe there may be some kind of bandwidth usage limits that may be reached when people are using one line, then they may automatically be routed to a second, third or fourth line depending on the volumn of usage?

That sound reasonable? I'm really kind of foggy on this subject. But I'm kind of thinking that maybe if I get 2 1.5 Meg download DSL lines and they go into a dual port router, that maybe I won't get twice the download speed anyway. I may still be at 1.5 Meg download?

Thank you for your input. Have a nice day.

I'll check out the link you provided. Thanks much.

[danielmaui]

I wonder if you've checked into a cable connection rather than DSL at this particular location. You can often get higher bandwidth from cable. I replaced a couple of maxed out 1.5Mbps/384k DSL connections at one property with (2) 3Mbps/768k cable connections. Cost went from $110 each to about $210 each, both commercial accounts. The cable connection offered even more bandwidth if we needed.

[BobY777]

Hi danielmaui:

Thank you for your info.

The only problem with using the cable at the hotel, that I'm thinking of, is that the franchise association won't allow cable due to security concerns.

It isn't a dedicated cable connection the way T1 or DSL is. Other people in the community can be on the same cable connection and mabey hack into the cable.

Although if a person is worried about secuity at a hotel, they would probably be using VPN anyway.

But I thank you for the input. Personally at my home, I would like to have cable for the higher speed. I don't think the security concerns are all that bad on cable.

Have a nice day and thanks again,

[agent007]

This has become of interest to me, as I need a big upstream pipe for my utility. I looked at the Cyclone router mentioned, but it raised another issue that hopefully someone can address here:

If two DSL's are coupled with this router, the aggregate bandwidth will effectively double for the number of users on the pipes. (In other words, now 60 users will be able to access the pipe instead of 30)BUT, for my application that needs a big pipe (video involved), will it split the traffic so that I can effectively use both pipes for one application? I'm guessing that it won't......

Thanks in advance!!

[kei-telecom.com]

Hi guys,

What happens when you use multiple DSL lines (or T's unless you order a high bandwidth T) is actually called 'load balancing.' For instance, if you have 2 ADSL lines at 1.5 mbps X 256 kbps and you use a load balancing device to joint the two you will still have a maximum down speedof 1.5mbps and max up speed of 256kbps - however you have twice the capacity. A good load balancing device will also provide QoS support and such. (You can actually find these fairly inexpensively. ($300 and up)


Another advantage is to have different ISP circuits at the same location balanced. (This way if say you have SBC dsl and Covad dsl and one goes out of service, the other will still be operative and you will not be completely down as well)
Here is a simple image showing simple load balancing: http://www.rad-direct.com/pictures-application/radware_01.gif

Linksys RV08 here (http://www.linksys.com/products/product.asp?grid=34&scid=29&prid=589)

Well, hope that helped....

[danielmaui]

I thought this article (http://www.nwfusion.com/reviews/2004/0913rev.html) called "Double your broadband, double your fun" from Network World Fusion might be of interest. It rates 5 dual-WAN routers - the ZyWall 70 from Zyxel Communications; TZ 170 from SonicWall; XC-DPG602 from Xincom; H2WR54G from Hawking Technologies; and FortiGate-60 from Fortinet.

PC Magazine also has an article on this called Two Connections Are Better than One (http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1641359,00.asp).

Daniel

[shohet18]

Edimax has two routers that can work for you on can use two line and one 4 lines adsl.edimax (http://www.edimax.com)

[MidcalBroadband]

There are a few router's that do the job that you need , We currently use two cicsco 2600 routers with two dual Wick cards that have 4 t1's in each. If you dont have any bandwidth management then you might want to have each T1 or dsl or whatever type of connection load balance. Have you looked at your bandwidth through a managed layer switch that does 7 layers? Maybe you have one person using all the bandwidth on one protocall like Napster or any type of P2P programe. Try Looking into Allot Box or Packeteer I have worked with both and they do a outstanding job. Anyway Hope this helps , and sorry for any bad spelling.

[usdan]

Here's another option: www.clarkconnect.org (http://www.clarkconnect.org). It is a home/business router package that you put on a PC. Your system can have multiple network cards; which permits for multiple WANs (and also multiple LANS).

The multi-WAN feature in ClarkConnect allows you to connect your system to multiple Internet connections. ClarkConnect multi-WAN not only provides load balancing, but also automatic failover.

Acts as a firewall, bandwidth monitor and IPS unit. You also can do bandwidth limiting and many many other functions.

I've used it on several installations now; including an office that serves 5 separate small offices - each on their own NIC.

They do have a free version, but to get the multiple ISP feature you have to pay the $75/yr.

Dan

[umdivx]

Where to even begin..... (man i have been away from here too long)

first off your ISP needs to support "bonded" connections. Such as T1's, your ISP/provider must support the ability to do Bonded T1's or Bonded DLS connections in order to effectively get twice the bandwidth. The devices aforementioned all they do is "share" the multiple ISP connections. So what happens if if the first connections fills up, the next sets of connections are moved over to the next connection. You CAN NOT get two DSL connections and use a "magic" box to increase the download speeds.

Are you running any QOS, traffic shaping? I'd look at doing that before increasing the bandwidth. Block all P2P apps, or anything other than standard Email, and web. You don't need a hotel guest download porn, they can do that at home.


Secondly The only problem with using the cable at the hotel, that I'm thinking of, is that the franchise association won't allow cable due to security concerns.

It isn't a dedicated cable connection the way T1 or DSL is. Other people in the community can be on the same cable connection and mabey hack into the cable.

What the hell you smoking? You can "Hack" a DSL connection just as easily as a cable connection. Effectively there is absolutely NO difference between DSL and cable internet connections in terms of security. Your connection is only as secure as your firewall permissions.

The one and ONLY difference between DSL and Cable is shared bandwidth, with DSL your on a dedicated PIPE, with DSL you get what your pay far (baring your ISP and their bandwidth to the internet) but with Cable you have a NODE, and on that NODE you can have multiple users, all those users share the available bandwidth to that NODE, but now days most cable operators have fixed those limitation issues and you hardly ever see that anymore. But again there isn't any difference in terms of security.

So again really the only effective way to increase your bandwidth is either if the ISP can do it and use the same ISP connection or by load balancing, which might work in this case or by a bonded connection. Bonded connections are the ONLY effective way of taking two ISP connections and doubling your bandwidth, but again your ISP needs to support it.

- Josh

[umdivx]

My bad I didn't realize this was a thread risen from the dead. arg.... anyways sorry for coming off the wrong way before. but I will leave my comments up as it does add some valuable info to others if they come looking.

- Josh

[golfnut]

One other thing that should be noted about load balancing devices, especially in a public setting, is they don't play nice with VPN connections.

Most load balancing devices won't balance sessions or users, it splits the data packets between wan links depending on how it's configured, so when it decides to bounce a few packets to the second wan link, the VPN session will most likely drop.

Greg

[marlehole]

Hello All,

The age old questions I thought were settled long ago; was reintroduced by none other than Boby777. Welcome back Bob, you couldn't let then RIP. But then again, it might be good for those Newbies' to the forum. The questions to which I refer are: (1) Bonding (2) ADSL vs Cable as it relates to speed; and to a lesser extent (3) Security in ADSL and Cable. These were subjects dear to my heart in the early days (a decade or so ago) of Broadband.

Josh is right on in his post and it should be cleaned up and be a "How To" in reference to Boby777's questions.

CCNA/CCNP 101:

(1) Bonding/Bundling: Except the ISP participates in the process, all you get as a client is Load Balancing. There are plenty of devices out there that provides that service; (and lots of manufacturers, who creates this "grey" area) on the subject. I refuse to say Redundency; because unless and until you deploy an alternative ISP; you have no Redundency. There is still a single point of failure. Author Joe Mehaffey does an excellent job of explaining the subject of Dual WAN Router Review (updated) at the upcoming link; and in fact a link to a site that has what looks to be a great solution on Wireless Hot Spots Balancing, (I have no affilliation to either). http://gpsinformation.info/joe/routers/MultiWANroouters.html

(2) ADSL vs Cable as it relates to Bandwidth: There are still ADSL users out there who will have you believe that all 1.5Mbps is the same. Not so; Service is provided in a circle/ring pattern from the CO. Unless you are in that "Inner Circle" you might offer "blood" there is no chance of you getting the speed suggested. This is why, in fairness to the ISPs, they will tell you all be it, in small print or under seperate cover; service is "best effort" and can not be guaranteed.

Cable on the other hand is a NODE system and though "Shared" they can offer you greater speeds (3Mbps, 4Mbps or even 5Mbps) and provide it.

So the ADSL purest shifted the argument between dedicated and shared

(3) Security between ADSL and Cable: Again, Josh got it exactly right; one's internal security is the only thing that makes a darn bit of difference. Josh, I'll take that, and coming over the wrong way and all. I need not say more except, Boby777 we can always trust you to provoke discussion. :D

"One more time for the Gipper." ;)

Good Luck for 2007 and beyond all,